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Time Wasting End of Game by Winning Team

billB


Responses To This Message:
Down Arrow RW "KC Swan" Lipp
Time Wasting End of Game by Winning Team Tuesday, 22 March 2005, at 3:07 p.m. US Eastern Time

G'day Yall.

I was just watching some Arena Football here over the weekend and they had an interesting rule that I thought could apply to The Aussie Rules Football.

The Rule related to the final minute of a game. If the team who was leading had the ball, then they were not allowed to kneel down. The rule would stop the clock unless the team made forward progress from the line of scrimmage. Running plays would stop the clock if the running back failed to make positive yards. It put an emphasis on the team having to keep playing football instead of simply running out the clock.

In the AFL, the team leading towards the end of the game, often starts to play "keepy off", with short passes, backwards passes, long waits before kicking the ball, etc. I hate it because the losing team doesn't get a chance to touch the ball, it slows down the game and the umpires seem to be too lenient on making the player hurry up to take a kick after a mark.

I would propose a similar rule to the Arena League.

Say in the last 5 minutes of a game, or at the 20 minute mark. No backwards kicks are allowed, either by stopping the clock until the ball starts to move forward (running, handball or kick), or award a free to the other team!

Another proposal might be that anytime the leading team takes a mark (or gets a free kick) in the last 5 minutes, the clock automatically stops until the ball is moved forward, they could back pass as much as they wanted, but the clock would not start until the player advances the ball. A similar situation already exists I believe with the kick in after a behind is scored, the clock stops until the player kicks it back in.

Another rule might be instead, that any backwards kick would not result in a mark, the ump would simply call play on (similar to a touched ball or a shorter than 15 yard kick). That way the losing team would get a chance to tackle the player and keep the ball moving.

Also I remember one game late last season on FSW (I believe either the Eagles or Dockers were down), where the Runner (of the leading team) was coming off the bench, telling the players exactly how much time was left in the game. The bench or the upstairs booth must have had access to the TV broadcast which showed the exact time remaining. I believe that should be outlawed, either by resticting the runner's actions or preventing a Tv broadcast into the stadium. If you can't restrict it that you might as well put the exact time up on the scoreboard. Any one remember that game?

I can remember going to games where the score was close at the end of the game, and you just had to keep looking at the clock at it ticked past 25 minutes into extra time, never really knowing when the game would end. I believe it made it more exciting for the players and the spectators, as the game had to be played out to the end.

Any one else have thoughts on my ideas, and has there been any talk of it in the Land Down Under??

Bill

   

RW "KC Swan" Lipp

In Response To:
Up Arrow billB

Responses To This Message:
Down Arrow Phil from Winnipeg
Down Arrow Bob
Re: Time Wasting End of Game by Winning Team Thursday, 24 March 2005, at 12:46 a.m. US Eastern Time


> The Rule related to the final minute of a game. If the team who was leading had the
> ball, then they were not allowed to kneel down.


The Canadian Football League has a similar rule. I am not sure of the exact mechanics, but the concept is similar.


> In the AFL, the team leading towards the end of the game, often starts to play
> "keepy off",


There is a rule in AFL to give a team incentive to pile on points or to keep trying to score in an obviously lost cause. It's called the percentage. The team that goes into a stall to run out the clock squanders an opportunity to boost their percentage.

So what? Well, let's look at the last ten year (courtesy of Dags). Every year that has been at least one tie on the ladder for points, broken by percentage. To what effect?

  • Eight times it impacted the right to host a final.
  • Once it determined which teams were in Qualifying or Elimination finals.
  • Three times if determined which team missed out on the finals entirely, leaving four teams on the outside looking in.
  • Eight other times it only impacted matchups of opponents for the finals.
  • This is twenty ties involving 43 teams.
  • 48.75% of finals berths were occupied by teams separated only by percentage.

So while a team may well squander that percentage, they do so at their own risk.
  • The '97 Port Adelaide Power found themselves ninth, almost 13-1/2% percentage points out of eighth.
  • The '02 Hawthorn Hawks were tenth, almost exactly 6% percentage points out of eighth.
  • The '02 Geelong Cats were 55 points away from playing in the finals. If they had kicked an extra goal in each of their eleven victories, they would have played finals football. They could have given up an extra behind to get that goal, and still made it.
  • the '98 Richmond Tigers were only 53 points away from playing in the finals! An additional goal in 3/4 of their twelve wins would have been more than enough.


> Also I remember one game late last season on FSW (I believe either the Eagles or
> Dockers were down), where the Runner (of the leading team) was coming off the bench,
> telling the players exactly how much time was left in the game.


There has been some real controversy on this the last few years. As I recall, one team had their runners changing hats, so the color revealed when the period was almost expired.


  -- RW "KC Swan" Lipp 

   

Phil from Winnipeg

In Response To:
Up Arrow RW "KC Swan" Lipp
Re: Time Wasting End of Game by Winning Team Thursday, 24 March 2005, at 1:23 p.m. US Eastern Time

>

> The Canadian Football League has a similar rule. I am not sure of the exact
> mechanics, but the concept is similar.

>
>

  -- RW "KC Swan" Lipp 


in the Canadian Football League, during the last 3 minutes of the game, the clock stops after every play, then starts up again when the referee spots the ball on the line of scrimmage. So in other words, the clock is stopped for the period of time when the tackled player goes down and the referee is able to grab the ball and put the ball down on one of the hash marks to get ready for the next play.

Also, the game clock cannot be completely runout between plays. Basically, players can still kneel the ball, but when the clock goes down to 0, another play has to be made to actually end the game. So for example, if there is 20 seconds left in the game, unlike the NFL, a player can't just kneel the ball and then have the clock run out and have the game over. In the CFL, the player would have to kneel the ball and have the clock run down to 0. In which case then the player would need to use another play and kneel down at the frozen 0 to actually end the game.

   

Bob

In Response To:
Up Arrow RW "KC Swan" Lipp «

Responses To This Message:
Down Arrow billB
« Re: Time Wasting End of Game by Winning Team Sunday, 3 April 2005, at 2:52 p.m. US Eastern Time


> The team that
> goes into a stall to run out the clock squanders an opportunity to boost their
> percentage.


But percentage only comes into play when teams are tied on wins and losses. In a tight game where the margin is six points or less, it seems better to hold onto the ball and preserve the victory rather than risking a turnover trying for an extra goal or behind.

But it does seem to me that the defending team could sometimes do a better job of covering potential receivers if they really want to cause a turnover. There usually seems to be one behind the ball uncovered.

   

billB

In Response To:
Up Arrow Bob
Re: Time Wasting End of Game by Winning Team Wednesday, 6 April 2005, at 7:53 p.m. US Eastern Time

>

>

> But it does seem to me that the defending team could sometimes do a better job of
> covering potential receivers if they really want to cause a turnover. There usually
> seems to be one behind the ball uncovered.

I agree it does seem like there is often an extra man behind the play that is left open for the easy back pass, mark and another 30 seconds or so of standing around waiting for a kick. I had suggested that could be eliminated by preventing the clock from starting until the team started to move the ball forward.

Time wasting is against the rules, such as holding after a mark, or throwing the ball away after the whistle. I just think the umps should be allowed to be much more stringent when it is obvious the team is taking it's time moving the ball on. I hate the guy that takes a mark. Puts the ball on the ground, kneels down, tightens the laces, slowly goes back for his kick, fakes a kick left, fakes right, looks long, umpire tells him to move it, waits a bit more, then finds his buddy 20 yards away, just back behind him. Then it all starts again.

Other sports have limits like basketball 24 second shot clock and a 5 second half court/ 5 second inbound. I like the idea of a shot clock after taking a mark - 15 seconds then the opposing team can just rush the kicker, like a punter in the NFL.

Also the AFL could look at some sort of bonus points other than mere percentage, such as bonus point for 20 goals, then another for 25 etc. Might not change things in a real close game, but at least the public would have something to root for.

Just keep the game great for every one.

May the Eagles long remain undefeated!

Bill

   

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